The Facts of the Case
On the night of February 26, 2012, 17 year old Trayvon Martin was fatally shot in Sanford, Florida by George Zimmerman, a volunteer watch commander. Zimmerman had confronted Martin after he called the police saying that he had spotted a suspicious looking person in his neighborhood. Police reports indicate that Trayvon proceeded to scuffle with Zimmerman, allegedly breaking his nose and slamming his head on the ground. Zimmerman then pulled his pistol and shot the teen. I don’t presume to know whether Zimmerman is telling the truth or not, but based on the story presented to the authorities, he acted in self-defense, so the only reason for the widespread call for his arrest is the public’s conviction that this was a hate crime.
Stand Your Ground
According to Florida Statutes Chapter 776.012, “a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if… he or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself.” Zimmerman’s father has stated that Martin said “you’re going to die now” during the scuffle he had with his son. Martin was also, according to witnesses, beating Zimmerman’s head against the ground, causing cuts and bruises to form. If this is the case, then the D.A.’s office is correct in not bringing Zimmerman in on murder charges.
Another recent case in Florida, decided by Circuit Judge Beth Bloom, found Greyston Garcia not guilty for murder for similar reasons. A burglar, carrying a bag of stolen stereos, attacked Garcia, who stabbed him with a kitchen knife in self-defense. Judge Bloom declared that the stabbing was a “necessary defense” for Garcia’s life. Martin was just as threatening as this burglar, if eye witness accounts are taken at face value.
The reason I continue to qualify my statements is that a recent police video shows Zimmerman entering the station after the attack without any blood on him. His nose appears fine and there are no gashes on his head, leading many to speculate that he may have falsified his story. However, it is important to remember that, according to the police report, he was treated by an EMS team on scene and would have been cleaned up a bit.
Was This A Hate Crime?
Martin is black, and Zimmerman is a “white” Hispanic. It has become clear that the mainstream media wants to make this into a case of white on black violence.
The Associated Press reported that one of Zimmerman’s 911 calls included a sound bite, in which “some listeners” claim Zimmerman muttered a racial slur. That same report speculated that the U.S. Department of Justice could get involved. I wouldn’t be surprised, since President Obama has already shown that he supported Martin before all of the facts were even out.
At first, the media tried to portray Martin as an innocent black teen, killed by the mean white neighborhood watch captain. Zimmerman had good reason to confront Martin, though, and it wasn’t because he was a random black teen. Recent burglaries committed by young black males had occurred in Zimmerman’s community, so when he spotted a black teen in a hoodie, it was his responsibility to confront him. It seems as though Martin was the one who decided to throw a punch. This wasn’t Martin’s first transgression, either; he had been suspended from school because marijuana residue was found in his book bag.
In case that isn’t evidence enough for why this isn’t a hate crime, Zimmerman and his wife mentored two black children for free. The mother of these children has stated that she had never heard Zimmerman use racial epithets nor do anything else to make her believe he was a racist.
George Zimmerman: Victim of Racism
In today’s society, the term “reverse racism” is often tossed around, but in reality, “reverse racism” is still just racism. Hateful individuals in the media, social groups, and the American public are labeling Zimmerman a racist, and want him strung up because he is half-white. He is already guilty in their eyes.
The New Black Panther Party posted a “WANTED!!! for the murder of Trayvon Martin… ALIVE, not dead or harmed,” message on the internet, calling for a citizen’s arrest of George Zimmerman. The New Black Panther Party’s Mikhail Muhammad then went on the Anderson Cooper Show and told him that the New Black Panther Party member doesn’t “obey the white man’s law,” but rather the “street people’s law.” So, apparently anyone with at least one white parent now has to worry about having the right to due process stripped from them by these thugs. I wonder if people with two white grandparents will be classified as “whiteys of the first degree” and those with only one white grandparent as “whiteys of the second degree.”
In another equally ignorant act, filmmaker Spike Lee accidently tweeted the address of an innocent lady who lives in Sanford in an attempt to get people to go to what he believed was Zimmerman’s house. This put an older lady in danger for no good reason. This is comparable to Al Sharpton’s involvement as an agitator in the Crown Heights riots, which resulted in the death of a Jewish student.
Think about this: if Zimmerman’s name sounded more Hispanic, would the media be acting the same way?
Adam Ondo | University of Rochester | Rochester, New York | @JoplinMaverick
George Zimmerman was originally processed without any racial influence and lawfully released according to the evidence of the incident. Then the racist groups caught wind of it and decided to use it to stir up their continuing racial strife and woe is me propaganda.
The NAACP effects every community and work place in America in the worst possible way for all Americans as would the KKK if that still existed and accepted. These groups continue to exist because their leaders don’t know how to be unsegregated Americans. Ancestry and skin color descriptions of who you are should be secondary to “I am an American”. These leaders that call themselves reverend are not worthy of reverence as they are the oppressors of the Negro race and a disgrace to our American society.
It is a pity that officials in high places (such as FL State Attorney Angela Corey) and most every personnel department in private and governmental business are influenced and afraid of these racial groups that have no business to exist in a non-racist America as they are the equivalent of a peaceful adaptation of the KKK. Or should it also be tolerated to force a Caucasian agenda?
E.G. All that needs to be done in the work place (for a person of the Negro race) is to protest and threaten to file a complaint and get the NAACP involved and miraculously the rules and regulations that pertain to all workers are over looked for these that are familiar with how the NAACP empowers a racist agenda to them.
And now we all are witnesses to this happening on the highest level as these racist groups and so called reverends rise up with their continued brainwashing unifying their segregated followers and that influences the media to convict a man through public peer pressure that then influences those in authority to appease the organized racist of our day. All in the misconception that they are anti-racist but in reality they are following a racist agenda.
It is not about race, guilt or innocence it is about how the masses are influenced through half-truths and a lack of individualism, patriotism and respect for our countries law and constitution that is in place to protect all citizens equally.
Down with racism! Let us all be individual Americans familiar with our constitutional rights and the laws that govern us. Not in hearsay via group and media influences. Don’t be a group follower! Be an “American” Not a segregated “fill in the blank____ American” Your oppressors will keep you in a segregated group it is an Americans right to be an individual!
R.L. Nelson
what is racism? most “common” to be declared in hate crime against another.
“White Racism” = Consists of name calling and desires for separatism.
“Black Racism” = Consists of intimidation, riots, torture, rape and murder.
As you can see,
“White Racism” is the greater evil and the cause of all America’s problems…
you never mention that the boy martin was going to see his dad. but most consertive hate obama so they have to fights because what ever obama says must be wrong in the eyes of the self rightes con. the boy is dead that the sad story but you seam to forget . he the boy had wepon of candy and a drink . he had no screw drive or hamer just candy. your blind with hatred thats the facets this boy was killed in cold blood. but you cant see that because of haterd of black obama who most cons says was born on the moon lol .
So much trash and misinformation. Can we expect any less from a nation of people whose ideals are to rape and use for gain any consequence or situation. We are reaping exactly what we are sowing. Government approved and people condoned of murdering little innocent lives. Actually we as a nation are doing remarkably well as we should be in total meltdown anarchy by now. We are mentally, morally, physically, economically, and ethically bankrupt and proudly have the most corrupt government on the face of the earth.
C. L.
“So much trash and misinformation.”
Evidence? No! Of course not! You don’t need evidence. You don’t need to show how or why. You’re an indoctrinated Useful Idiot. You just need to repeat the bumper-sticker slogans and all is good. Hope and Change! That’s all we need to chant. We don’t have to “Hope” for anything. We just need to FEEL like we belong to the Cult of Liberalism and magic will happen. And when someone disagrees with the Cult of Liberalism we just scream BIAS! and TRASH! and MISINFORMATION!!!111one
Now “Case Logic” will go back to waving sacred incense over his Obama Shrine.
your out of your mind plain and simple you guys hate obama that is sad. just holler money money money that all the conserves care about that why we will see a big ass beaten they are going to get in nov when obama wins in a land slide . just cry walfair , but keep diveniing big oil billion lol/ no problem there hu . juat get the black off food stamps. i am white and obama has compasion for the poor were rep have zero. so my vote from this whate ,man is for obama
All I have to say is the rev Jackson is calling for the repeal of “stand your ground”. I think its a safe bet that he doesn’t mean to disarm his pistol packing security guards. I’m quite sure if someone even looked threatening towards him that his entourage would use deadly force and no one would say a word…….
Martin’s drug use has nothing to do with this case. Using it as if it’s some sort of evidence doesn’t give you much credit that you’re viewing this case without racial glasses.
Actually, it does. If you look at the rap sheets of prisoners in middle security prisons, most of them have committed around a dozen offenses on average, usually beginning with drug use, escalating to theft/burglary, and then on to assault. This trend would be seen with a teen, who uses drugs, wants more, burglarizes, and then gets in a fight. Maybe Trayvon Martin is completely innocent, that’s up for a jury to decide, all I am saying is that it can be used as evidence. And presenting patterns of criminal acts are not racist, as most of the inmates’ whose rap sheets I have read have been white. Criminals are criminals, and follow similar patterns of crime, no matter the race.
Yea, no. There was no pot at the scene and there was no evidence at the crime that he was on drugs.
Just as criminals has have a history of drug use, people who are victims of crimes often have a history of drug use as well.
Further, pot use is not indicative of agressive crime. Its not like he was in trouble for meth. He’s a high schooler who did pot – just like many other high schoolers.
It has no baring on this case.
“Further, pot use is not indicative of agressive crime.”
Liar! In 1993 I was arrested and charges were dropped for Aggravated Assault with a Firearm. The perps who attacked me said and I quote, “We were just getting high and looking for trouble.” Extensive pot use eventually turns you into a bomb-throwing Liberal Idiot.
But that sweet, innocent Marxist and Atheist Jared Loughner agrees with you.
Yes because pot is the only thing people can get high on. Not acid, PCP or coke.
Hippies were known for being exceptionally violent after all. Nobody ever associates pot, hippies and peace, love and rock and roll.
Since we’re talking about unrelated and alleged incidents that have nothing to do with the actual crime, would Zimmerman’s history of arrests for violent crime on three previous occasions not also be considered evidence pointing to a person’s likelihood of committing this violent crime? I would think that it would be a bit of a stretch to say that a person who smokes pot is more likely to be the aggressor than the person with the history of aggression.
When did those “previous occasions” occur?
Martin was suspended from school while all of this happened. Martin’s problems were in the present, not in the past. You do know the difference between past and present right? Extensive pot use makes it difficult to keep track of when you are.
Yea, Martin’s one incident of trouble is more important that Zimmerman’s repeated history of violence. He’s been fired from jobs for being too agressive and he had reports from the other home owners in the community about him following them home.
(And the reports/complaints from his neighbors to their Homeowner’s Assocation? Very much in the present.)
Not much “cherry picking” of facts in this post is there?
The scales are clearly not on Mr Zimmerman’s side, and the news gets worse each day (two independant experts have reported it is scientifically impossible that the cries for help were from Mr Zimmerman… he is a liar as well as a killer).
“We are the next generation of leaders”… RIP America!
“Not much “cherry picking” of facts in this post is there?”
Then post them. Go ahead! If it’s so obviously then where are they? Oh but you can’t. You’re a Useful Idiot. You don’t need evidence. You have faith in the agenda. Hope and Change! No really! That actually meant something right? We don’t need to change TO something. We don’t need to know what it is we’re changing into. All changed is good right? We don’t need evidence. We’re Liberals!
Shame on the totally biased, ‘politically correct’ tabloid carnival barkers on the networks and cable stations that masquerade around as actual NEWS agencies that we blindly put our trust in to tell us the TRUTH. Was the death of Trayvon Martin a tragedy and a loss – yes. Is George Zimmerman an evil murdering racist? According to an utterly biased and only marginally informed part of the American community he is, and that’s just as tragic as the death of this young man who may or may not have been a critical factor in creating the conditions that lead to his unfortunate death.
The FACT, as inconvenient as it for the media, is – we don’t know what happened between Zimmerman and Martin and we shouldn’t pretend to. You were not there, I was not there, and frankly, had the fallen party in this dispute been white, Asian, or Hispanic – none of us would know about it now, period. It simply wouldn’t be a story. But, with the media making a very intentional decision to show only innocent, sweet, much-younger and endearing photos of Trayvon Martin and a mug shot of Zimmerman, along with their equally intentional decision to dramatically edit the 911 all so as to make Zimmerman appear to be racial profiling, they, THE MEDIA igniting a race war in American and made Zimmerman their scapegoat. The utterly one-sided approach to this tragic story has succeeded in creating a climate where it is not only favorable but politically expedient to take a liberal stance relative to this tragic situation because frankly, to do otherwise is to be thought of as a racist and no one wants that, especially the media.
That is NOT LIBERTY people, that is yet another form of enslavement. Can we not hold our seats, and our tongues and be willing to HEAR THE FACTS and make a decision based solely on the merits and objective evidence presented relative to this case, and make it about ‘that’ rather than making the quantum leap that it’s an automatic truism that it’s all about the color of the decedent’s skin and that NOTHING else that transpired that night contributed to the ultimate outcome.
We must be willing to allow our judicial system to do its job and then accept the ultimate decision it hands down and STOP trying this case in the media. You know, many people disagreed with the decision in the Simpson/Brown trial many years ago. Al Gore disagreed with the Supreme Court’s decision, and most of America disagreed with the conclusion of the Casey Anthony case, but, we acknowledged that our justice system did its job and we, as a nation of many colors and communities complied with the rulings that were handed down in this landmark cases. Let us do the same this time.
Bottom line: THE MEDIA’S JOB IS TO REPORT THE NEWS – NOT TO ‘MAKE IT’ OR TRY TO INLFUENCE IT!
ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? Debate all you want to about whether or not this was a hate crime. Personally, I have doubts about that myself. But to act like this kid had it coming because there was marijuana residue in his locker is pretty messed up. Last time I checked, the penalty for this type of infraction committed by a minor isn’t supposed to be capital punishment. By the way, if some strange guy was following and, eventually, coming after me while I was minding my own business, I would probably have punched him too. If he did punch him, I just hope it really freaking hurt! Have you not been paying any attention to this case? No one involved with the case has denied the FACT that Zimmerman went after Martin after being told explicitly not to by the dispatcher. If anyone was standing their ground, it was Martin. I have no idea how you think that this other case involving Greyston Garcia is at all similar to this one. One of them involved an armed man committing robbery and attacking someone; the other involved an unarmed boy walking to a friends house not committing any crime or initiating a confrontation.
“Zimmerman had good reason to confront Martin, though, and it wasn’t because he was a random black teen. Recent burglaries committed by young black males had occurred in Zimmerman’s community, so when he spotted a black teen in a hoodie, it was his responsibility to confront him.”
I don’t know whether or not Zimmerman is a racist, but if this is what you really think, then, clearly, YOU ARE. It was his duty to confront him for being a black teen in a hoodie? It wasn’t his DUTY to confront anyone. He was NOT a cop. He was NOT being threatened in any way when he decided to stalk and confront an unarmed teenager. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU?????
I don’t appreciate being called racist by someone who cannot see basic logic in my argument. If I am told that a burglary has been committed and I then report a black teen, that is racist, because I am assuming that because he is black that he must have committed the crime. However, if I am told that a burglary has been committed by a YOUNG BLACK MALE, it would be very illogical to call the police and say that I am looking at a suspicious looking WHITE teen in a hoodie, because the burglar was BLACK, and clearly you would only report someone who fit the suspect’s description.
You are right. I absolutely cannot see the “basic logic” in your argument. If he was actually doing something, other than simply being young and black, that seemed suspicious, then it would make sense. He wasn’t. Unless I am completely misundertstanding what you wrote, it sounds very much like racial profiling.
Zimmerman didn’t target Martin because he was racist, but because Martin fit the description of criminal suspects.
If I know that of 80 people on a flight, 1 of them is probably a terrorist from the group Boko Haram (Nigerian), and there are 8 black guys, those will probably be the guys I search most thoroughly. Not because they are black, but because they look like members of Boko Haram (Nigerians just happen to be black).
Ever notice when black people are involved, the description is usually “they’re black.”
But when its a while person, its “brown hair, blue eyes, big nose, etc.”
Not racist at all.
Actually, your assumption that Zimmerman continued chasing Martin after he was told not has not been confirmed. It has been reported that Zimmerman broke off the chase and it was Martin who returned to confront Zimmerman. And since you yourself claim you’d go back after someone chasing you and you’d punch them in the face, isn’t it POSSIBLE that Martin was just as hot-headed and foolish as you? And in doing so, he escalates the situation leading to a situation where someone is going to get seriously hurt or killed. Ask any lawyer or police officer, there is no law against pursuing a suspicious person, but there is against assault, and since Martin punched it, it is that action that opens the door to a self-defense shooting. A 911 operator is not a police officer and has no legal authority to direct anyone. Zimmerman broke no laws up to the point he was punched.
We don’t know all the details and we don’t know what happened that night. All this conjecture only leads to dug-in opinions that will make it impossible to accept the truth if it happens to contradict what you believe.
Now that we know that Zimmerman is a registered Democrat, maybe the racist Republican label will be corrected or will race no longer be a part of the issue?
I don’t know what you are talking about. It HAS been confirmed that he chased him during the call. And I never said anything about “going back” to someone who was chasing me, and it certainly has not been confirmed that this is what Martin did. I’m saying that a person should have the right to defend themselves against someone who is chasing them with no authority and no reason to do so.
“There is no law against pursuing a suspicious person…” There are laws against stalking, harassment, and murder.
You are correct in saying that a 911 dispatcher is not a police officer. However, an important part of their job involves advising people who call in on what is the best course of action in a given situation. They are professionally trained to know how to respond. In a medical emergency, would you not take their advice seriously while waiting for an ambulance? Yes, you would, because unless you are a trained medical professional, they probably know a lot more than you do. This entire situation is the result of him not taking what was obviously very sound advice.
As far as conjecture goes, you don’t know that Martin punched Zimmerman or that Martin returned to confront Zimmerman, and yet you have clearly formed your own opinion about the situation, but somehow, I am the one jumping to conclusions?
“Now that we know that Zimmerman is a registered Democrat, maybe the racist Republican label will be corrected or will race no longer be a part of the issue?” I specifically said that I have not come to the conclusion that Zimmerman is a racist or that the shooting was racially motivated. I said that this article was.
Visiting Gate Villages before or any private university with a guard gate, one NORMALLY CHECKS in at the Gate and Gate Keep informs Neighborhood Watch and other security forces that a PERSON who does not live in the Gated Village, and who is not Registered, is the guest of XXX. It appears that the fiancee of Martin’s father either FORGOT to let the security, guard gate and also Neighborhood Watch that she was having a guest, her boyfriend (finance) and his son. And if she had done, so Martin would be alive with very high probability. When approached by security and neighborhood watch patrols in Brasil, I said HI, told them who I was visiting and chatted with them. I did not run, or feel threatened in a GATED VILLAGE. Martin had ABSOLUTLELY no reason to fear anyone in a GATED VILLAGE, if he were not up to something fishy. Was he casing home for some of this friends who had been robbing people’s homes. It has been reported that Martin had in his locker women’s jewlery which was NOT HIS. He said it was not his, but that of a friends. He was in possession of possible stolen jewlery. And homes in the Gated Village were being robbed by black males and people where with very high probably providing the thiefs with INSIDER information. It would be very interesting to check if Martin mobile phone had PINGS in the areas where the robberies had occurred or days before, after having cased the homes, places, etc. A lot of information is not being provided. The police, Homeland Security, the security provided by the home owners association, the FBI and even the Mexican Government and United Nations are all probably also investigating, as Hispanic American is having his reputation destroyed for defending himself agaist someone who assaulted him. The police report, now made available by the police, states that the Zimmerman had a bloody nose and a wound on the back of his head, and that FIRST AID was provided in the police car, that is the blood was cleaned up and his wounds here attended to. Kind of like in an NBA game where a player is assaulted, like when Kermit Washington assaulted Rudy T. The wounds are attended to on the spot. Martin was given CPR and the police tried to resusitate him. Similarly Zimmerman*s wound were attended to. Martin picked a fight with the wrong person. Fortunately for Brittany G. and Kobe B. they did not pick fights or attempt to rape Zimmerman in Florida, like they did in Texas and Colorado respecively. If they had, they may have suffered similar fates. Poor Nicole Simson and her boy friend and Shannon Christian were both brutally murdered. And the Shannon Christian was a racially motivated rape, murder and mutilation. But no major presss coverage, And the crimes were worse than those in Nazi Germany or in Imperialist Japan. But again, no major media coverage. Why? The criminals were black males and one black female, who once again did not have to face the Nation and World, like Zimmmerman is now made to do. Why not. The people in Europe want to know. The American Press appears to be at an all time low. And let us all forget, the USA press also reported weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, which were lies, misinformation and deception, similar to what appears to be being reported against Zimmerman and the Branch Davidians who were killed/murdered under Bill Clinton and Janet Reno’s watch. The treatment of American Civil Liberties under Clinton and Obama are pretty poor. The American People should demand better from their leaders. Hopefully in the fall the USA will get a new President and he/she will make a major investigation of some of the aforementioned crimes which were never properly investigated and no charges filed (Kobe Bryant and Brittany Griner for rape and assault against while coeds in Colorado and Texas). By not prosecuting those cases, Martin thought he had a Right to Act Violently against Zimmerman. Maybe in Colorado and Texas, but NOT in Florida!!
For your information, citizens arrest is perfectly LEGAL! So did Zimmerman have the right to inquire of Treyvon? ABSOLUTELY! Did he have to answer him? Of Course not. He also didn’t have to ATTACK Zimmerman, which has been CONFIRMED BY EYE WITNESSES THAT HE DID! SO SHUT UP WITH YOUR IGNORANT RANTS AND CALLING SOMEONE RACIST WITH NO PROOF OF THAT! BY THE WAY, I AM A BLACK 18-YEAR-OLD IN 12TH GRADE AND I’M INTELLIGENT ENOUGH TO SEE THIS IS NOT A HATE CRIME!
In order for a citizens arrest to be legal in the US, Zimmerman would of have to witness Martin committing a crime. Walking around a neighborhood is not a crime unless he was trespassing and he wasn’t.
So no, Zimmerman did not have the right to make a citizens arrest.
“I would probably have punched him too…”
And you would have been shot dead too.
People have a RIGHT to follow you. You don’t have a RIGHT to punch them for walking the same direction you’re walking, or driving in the same direction you’re walking. It takes a special kind of stupid to believe that punching strangers in the face is morally superior to the stranger retaliates. Or, it just takes a decade of Liberal Indoctrination. Since you’re too stupid to understand this I hope for your sake you wander through a gated community in Florida.
Never bring a knife to a gunfight. And if you’re a paranoid idiot, never bring NOTHING to a gunfight.
Except Zimmerman wasn’t just walking in the same direction Martin was. And Martin ran away from him. He clearly felt threated and attempted to remove himself from the situation.
Not that it necessarily changes anything that you’ve written, but did you see the Daily Caller story yesterday showing what may be a gash on the back of Zimmerman’s head?
http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/29/police-surveillance-video-of-zimmerman-may-show-head-injury/
It is a terrible example of the media and the Left finding racism where none appears to exist. Maybe a crime was committed, and that should be investigated, but I don’t think it was racial in nature.
Tabita, I cannot agree more. The liberal media should be ashamed of itself. Whatever happened to INNOCENT before PROVEN guilty. Not only were the photos doctored but the 911 tape was heavily edited so as to make it sound as if Zimmerman was/is a racist. The 911 Operator asked Zimmerman whether the person was white, hispanic, or black and Zimmerman said “I think he’s black” but virtually every major network and CNN played the doctored version that does not include the 911 Operators questions, only Zimmerman appearging to call attention to the person’s color. My Lord, what kind of country are we living in, where what we are supposed to trust as objective NEWS COVERAGE is liberally biased based propoganda!
I DON’T think this was a hate crime, and I don’t think it’s all that relevant whether it was or wasn’t. But there’s enough doubt about what actually happened that Zimmerman should be brought to trial and all the evidence heard.
You cite Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law, but you fail to mention it goes against hundreds of years of common law which has held a “duty to retreat.”
You are correct. Duty to retreat has been the rule for many years. But why? If I’m standing in a place that I have every right to be, why is it my duty to give that spot up? Because an aggressor wants it? Is that how America was built? That would mean the Boston massacre was the civilian’s fault for not retreating. How about the Alamo? Are we to allows give way to the bully? I think what’s happening now is a feeling of being fed up with being pushed around and people are finally saying, “I’ve had enough and will not take anymore of this abuse.” And I can’t blame them.
“If I’m standing in a place that I have every right to be, why is it my duty to give that spot up? Because an aggressor wants it?”
That’s why we have courts of law.
“That would mean the Boston massacre was the civilian’s fault for not retreating.”
No, actually. If I, an aggressor, kill you, I’m responsible for my murder no matter where you were standing or whether you retreated. But if you had retreated, it might have prevented my murder, so it’s good for everyone that you have a duty to retreat.
Just to point something out, the soldiers are actually the people who needed the Stand Your Ground laws, because their lives felt threatened by the violent and unruly mob of colonists (and ruffian mariners). John Adams awesome defense does a great job describing how the soldiers were doing this in self-defense. The case is very similar to Kent State, where a mob of students burned down a recruiting center and then cornered national guardsmen between them and a fence. The soldiers in these cases are blamed for shooting civilians, but really it is the mobs who were responsible.
Are you kidding me?! It’s good for everyone to retreat before an aggressor? Good for the aggressor, he gets what he wants, your fear, your property, your life!? You go right on and back off, I will stand my ground!
Again, I will say, that’s why we have courts of law. It’s best for everyone to deescalate the situation as much as reasonably possible to prevent the loss of life and property.
“Stand your ground” may sound good in theory, but it’s an invitation to preemptively kill anyone who even looks suspicious.
What’s more, it’s perfectly logical for me to say I shot you because I had a reasonable suspicion that you’d have a reasonable suspicion that I’d shoot you.
Or because I had a reasonable suspicion that you’d have a reasonable suspicion that I’d have a reasonable suspicion you’d shoot me. I could continue ad absurdum…
In essence, he who shoots first wins. “Self defense” becomes a legitimate excuse for just about any non-premeditated murder.
I don’t know about you, but that doesn’t sound like civil society to me…
“That’s why we have courts of law.”
This sums up the Leftist mentality perfectly! We all must wait until the Wise Overlords of Liberalism deem our existence worthy.
Seriously, you’re a liar. If you REALLY believed that you’d speak out against “Civil Disobedience” because you already know “the law.” The “courts” have already decided “the law” the disobedience is the exactly opposite of following “the law” and therefore you’re 100% against it.
Nope. You’re just another Useful Idiot.
“so it’s good for everyone that you have a duty to retreat.”
You’re a perfect victim! Let’s all run away and give all of our property over to the criminals where we’ll need to track them down and then sue them to get it back. What a great idea! Let’s hope the criminals aren’t faster than we are otherwise “C” will scream racism and say we weren’t “doing our duty” because we couldn’t run out of our neighborhood fast enough.
No wonder Leftist cities and countries are riddled with crime. Every indoctrinated Liberal idiot ran away and gave it to the criminals.
“In essence, he who shoots first wins. “Self defense” becomes a legitimate excuse for just about any non-premeditated murder.”
Criminals ALREADY operate under this assumption. No criminal fears a nutless Libtard. If a criminal has to choose between an armed target and a nutless Libtard who make it his sacred duty to run like a girl they will choose you. Every time.
I guess Liberals are just creating job security for criminals. Liberal Laws are OSHA for the criminal worker. They protect the mugger, rapist, burglar, and thug.
In 1905, Judge Jaggard of the Minnesota State Supreme Court explained why the Castle Doctrine was important: “The doctrine of ‘retreat to the wall’ had its origin before the general introduction of guns. . . . It would be good sense for the law to require in many cases, an attempt to escape from hand to hand encounter with fists, clubs, and even knives… while it would be rank folly to so require when experienced men, armed with repeating rifles, face each other in an open space, removed from shelter, with intent to kill or do great bodily harm,” State v. Gardner, 104 N.W. 971 (1905).
The law changes, even after many centuries, in order to go with the times. Technology changes, so we have to make sure the law still protects us.
Much more evidence of RAPE by Kobe Bryant. The victim’s blood was all over his tee shirt. He WAS GUILTY OF RAPE and walked. And his wife, Kobe’s, now did the right thing: DIVORCE. Hopefully she will get a restraining order against him. What Kobe did in Colorado, he might do again to his or other children. Hopefully the Brits will refuse him entrance to the UK during the London Olympics, as it would be a disgrace to have a rapist represent the USA in London. The NBA and the LA Lakers do not appear to care about Kobe’s raping of the young coed in Colorado. And then there is Brittany Griner assault of the Texas Tech coed on NATIONAL TV. And what did she get? Felony assault charges? Suspended for the year, like the Oregon football player who SWUNG at a Boise State player, or the young New Mexico coed soccer player who was suspended for the year for pulling the hair of a BYU coed? No!! Brittany Griner got/received only a one game suspension, for breaking the nose of the Texas Tech coed. Violence by black males and females against both black and white is way too prelevant, and is going unpunished. And finally in Detroit, two you black famales were kidnapped, blindfold, gagged and shot in the head. Why? Because they refused to take a bribe not to testify against the person who shot at her car as she was leaving, after having broken up with him. Why was he not arrested and allowed to run free after having at the young black coed? Sad, as two more super intelligent bright young black coeds, future Condelica Rice’s murdered. So sad. And where are Jessy J. And Al S.? Defending thugs who resort to violence like Martin, Kobe and Brittany G. But who is defending the two female black coeds brutally executed by black males? Noone. Sad. Really sad.
Hundreds of years of “common law?” Florida has had the “Make-My-Day-Law” for decades. How ignorant.
I think you misread my post. Retreat-to-the-wall was a common law doctrine that lasted many centuries. In recent years, though, many states have updated their laws to be Stand-Your-Ground laws.